What is the difference between there CPU designs?

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KliK
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What is the difference between there CPU designs?

Post by KliK »

on intel site i saw "PPGA" for celerons which goes on BP6 motherboard...and in some later cases there were "370 Socket PPGA" procesors as celerons and P3...do those go on BP6 motherboard?
can it be done without modds, after all it is the PPGA design...or am i wrong?!
:)
BCN
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Post by BCN »

P3 are FCPGA and tualatin core are FCPGA-2

No you cannot use P3 without mods on this board.
You may use Powerleap Neo S370 adapter for coppermine P3, though for using in dual mode, you need to mod the board ant the adapters. there are lots of info on that in the forums on this site.
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KliK
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Post by KliK »

BCN wrote:P3 are FCPGA and tualatin core are FCPGA-2

No you cannot use P3 without mods on this board.
You may use Powerleap Neo S370 adapter for coppermine P3, though for using in dual mode, you need to mod the board ant the adapters. there are lots of info on that in the forums on this site.

and what are these?

sSpec# CPU Speed Bus Speed Mfg. Tech Stepping Cache Size Package Type
SL6BY 1.40 GHz 133 MHz 0.13 micron tB1 512 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL64W 1.40 GHz 133 MHz 0.13 micron tA1 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL5XL 1.40 GHz 133 MHz 0.13 micron tA1 512 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL657 1.40 GHz 133 MHz 0.13 micron tA1 512 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL5VX 1.33 GHz 133 MHz 0.13 micron tA1 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL5LW 1.26 GHz 133 MHz 0.13 micron tA1 512 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL6BX 1.26 GHz 133 MHz 0.13 micron tB1 512 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL5QL 1.26 GHz 133 MHz 0.13 micron tA1 512 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL5GN 1.20 GHz 133 MHz 0.13 micron tA1 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL5PM 1.20 GHz 133 MHz 0.13 micron tA1 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL5QK 1.13 GHz 133 MHz 0.18 micron cD0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL5GQ 1.13 GHz 133 MHz 0.13 micron tA1 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL5PU 1.13 GHz 133 MHz 0.13 micron tA1 512 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL5LT 1.13 GHz 133 MHz 0.13 micron tA1 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL6BW 1.13 GHz 133 MHz 0.13 micron tB1 512 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL5LV 1.13 GHz 133 MHz 0.13 micron tA1 512 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL5QW 1.10 GHz 100 MHz 0.18 micron cD0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL5GR 1.00 GHz 133 MHz 0.13 micron tA1 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL4C8 1.00 GHz 133 MHz 0.18 micron cC0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL5QV 1.00 GHz 100 MHz 0.18 micron cD0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL5FQ 1.00 GHz 133 MHz 0.18 micron cD0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL4MF 1.00 GHz 133 MHz 0.18 micron cC0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL52R 1.00 GHz 133 MHz 0.18 micron cD0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL5DV 1.00 GHz 133 MHz 0.18 micron cD0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL5B3 1.00 GHz 133 MHz 0.18 micron cD0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL4C9 933.00 MHz 133 MHz 0.18 micron cC0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL5DW 933.00 MHz 133 MHz 0.18 micron cC0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL52Q 933.00 MHz 133 MHz 0.18 micron cD0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL44J 933.00 MHz 133 MHz 0.18 micron cB0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL4SD 900.00 MHz 100 MHz 0.18 micron cC0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL4ZJ 866.00 MHz 133 MHz 0.18 micron cD0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL4CB 866.00 MHz 133 MHz 0.18 micron cC0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL5DX 866.00 MHz 133 MHz 0.18 micron cD0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL4Z2 850.00 MHz 100 MHz 0.18 micron cD0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL4CC 850.00 MHz 100 MHz 0.18 micron cC0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL49G 850.00 MHz 100 MHz 0.18 micron cB0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL43H 850.00 MHz 100 MHz 0.18 micron cB0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL463 800.00 MHz 100 MHz 0.18 micron cB0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL4MA 800.00 MHz 100 MHz 0.18 micron cC0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL4CE 800.00 MHz 100 MHz 0.18 micron cC0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL4MB 800.00 MHz 133 MHz 0.18 micron cC0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL52P 800.00 MHz 133 MHz 0.18 micron cD0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL3Y2 800.00 MHz 133 MHz 0.18 micron cB0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL5QD 800.00 MHz 133 MHz 0.18 micron cD0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL4CF 750.00 MHz 100 MHz 0.18 micron cC0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL462 750.00 MHz 100 MHz 0.18 micron cB0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL4CG 733.00 MHz 133 MHz 0.18 micron cC0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL45Z 733.00 MHz 100 MHz 0.18 micron cB0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL4ZL 733.00 MHz 133 MHz 0.18 micron cD0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL3XY 733.00 MHz 133 MHz 0.18 micron cB0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL45Y 700.00 MHz 100 MHz 0.18 micron cB0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL3XX 700.00 MHz 100 MHz 0.18 micron cB0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL3XW 667.00 MHz 133 MHz 0.18 micron cB0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL45W 650.00 MHz 100 MHz 0.18 micron cB0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL4CL 600.00 MHz 133 MHz 0.18 micron cC0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
SL5BT 600.00 MHz 100 MHz 0.18 micron cD0 256 KB 370 pin PPGA
InactiveX
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Post by InactiveX »

None of those will work on an unmodded BP6 without adaptors.

It would help if you gave us the source of those figures, ie. a web address.
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Post by davd_bob »

KliK,
first off let me say WELCOME to BP6.com
KliK wrote:
BCN wrote:P3 are FCPGA and tualatin core are FCPGA-2 No you cannot use P3 without mods on this board.
and what are these?
SL6BY 1.40 GHz 133 MHz 0.13 micron tB1 512 KB 370 pin PPGA
BCN is correct.
The great INTEL folks have some stuff on their website that is...how can I say this without starting trouble???
inaccurate.

The BP6 was created for one purpose. Inexpensive dual cpu processing.
Intel reported that celerons could not "dual", but they didn't design the ability out of the Mendocino core...assuming that since they said it couldn't be done no one would try.
Intel just changed the pin connections so the dual controller pin was somewhere else on the chip. Abit designed the BP6 to allow SMP using Celerons(which were less then half the price of P2s)without modification.

At about the same time Intel made P2 and P3 SLOT chips consumers wanted a cheap CPU so Intel made intorduced Celerons.
First only slot one and then they added socket 370.
Genericly speaking the only mass produced socket 370 PPGA chips are Mendocino core Celerons. Any claims by anyone otherwise to have a PPGA socket 370 is either a modified setup, bogus, an error, or an outright lie.

Here is kind of a generic breakdown on Pentium-III chips that actually exist.
P3 PPGA=slot1 only
P3 FC-PGA=Coppermine core socket 370 and some slot chips
P3 FC-PGA2=Tualatin core socket 370 and...

Intel didn't make socket 370 P3 chips below in the FC-PGA class.

How can the info be explained on their website? Maybe, long ago, they created the web data when they were planning those cpus but before the cpus ever got made and they were just to lazy to fix the data when the plans for the chips got canceled before production began.

I think this info is all accurate in as much as you can get every peice of hardware I mentioned on eBay but anything I didn't mention, you can't get ahold of anyway.
There are *almost* no bad BP6s. There are mostly bad caps.

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phaedrus
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Post by phaedrus »

PIIIs greater than 1.0GHz are Tualatins and the are FC-PGA2. 1.0GHz or less, they are FC-PGA. FC-PGA in both cases stands for "flip chip pin grid array". They could also accurately be called FCPPGA--PPGA means "plastic pin grid array", and the PIII's are still technically PPGA style packaging.

The flip chip part refers to the fact that the silicon die is on the opposite side of the package than the Celerons. The celerons had the die on the bottom, whereas the PIIIs have the die on top--which allows for better contact with the heat sink.

Intel, being themselves, incorporated some other changes to the socket when they flipped the die to the other side. They changed Vtt to 1.25V from 1.5, and they changed some pins around (the most infamous being BRQ1). When they updated to FCPGA2, they rearranged signals again.

IIRC, the only processor to use PPGA packaging was the Celeron1. All other socket 370 chips use one of the FC-PGA package styles. If you want the power boost of using a PIII in your BP6, you've got to break out the soldering iron. Otherwise, the Celeron 533 is the fastest at 66MHz FSB, however, the consensus around here is that 366@550 is the unmodified speed king, if you're willing to overclock a bit.

Jeff
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They said... and now my BP6 needs new processors... D'oh
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BCN
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Post by BCN »

to add to that, all tualatins (FCPGA2) are 0.13 process, and all the coppermines (FCPGA) are 0.18 process, as you will see there are some coppermines P3 at 1.13GHz.
Dual C366@550MHz 1.90V :) (History)
yet single PIII-S 512Kb L2 cache at 1400MHz@700MHz
BP6 (not modded yet)
256MB PC133 C2
GF4Ti4200-8x
Maxtor 2x60Gb - all on promise ATA133
Lite-On LTR 40125S@48125W!!!
Plus P4 system
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Post by InactiveX »

phaedrus wrote:PIIIs greater than 1.0GHz are Tualatins and the are FC-PGA2. 1.0GHz or less, they are FC-PGA.
There is also a bit of overlap. I have a 933MHz PIII (non-Tualatin) that is FC-PGA2. The only difference from the 933MHz FC-PGA is that mine has an integrated heat-spreader. It confused me royally when I was trying to find a motherboard to match it.
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Post by Dave Rave »

i think, that some twit in Intel did a dumbed down version to help with ease of reading but only increased the problem.

the PPGA, FC-PGA and FC-PGA-2 are all 370 pin PPGA - Plastic Pin Grid Array

but they are pinned differently.
some manufacturers made boards that could tell the chips apart and auto detect all three cpu types and post.
some didn't go all the way, but the manuals don't specifically mention what chips will and which chips won't work. you have to find all the fine print between the lines. or compare mentioned FSB speeds with known cpu limits.

hohum
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