Can I remove the CPU fans?

jakfr02 · Post by **jakfr02** » Thu Jan 20, 2005 7:27 am

I want to remove the cpu fans to make the box quiter. I have 2x500's with no modifications. I have good case air flow. I was thinking about lower the voltage on the cpus.

Once when I had 1x500 and 1x400 celerons, I unplugged the fan from the 400 on the second socket and forgot to plug it back. It went that way for about a month.

So, has anyone done this before?
There is a warning in the bios for overheating. Should I use that and what max temp should I set it to?
What is a good freeware, cpu temp monitor utility?
How low could I expect to go on lowering the cpu voltage?
Maybe I should try a one of those cpu burn-in programs for testing. Any recommendations for a freeware one?

jakfr02 · Post by **jakfr02** » Thu Jan 20, 2005 3:00 pm

Oops forgot to mention, I realized at least I need to keep the heatsinks on the 500's.

hugoc · Post by **hugoc** » Fri Jan 21, 2005 1:44 pm

So, has anyone done this before?

I have fans on my heatsinks, but they're not spinning right now and they generally won't in the course of an average day. My system temps are 30C on each CPU and 33 on the motherboard. Under load they go up about 3-5 degrees. However, the system is located in my laundry room which is only about 10-15 C (I pass all my cables through the wall). So if you add 5-10 degrees to those temperatures to arrive at a more normal room temperature, you're looking at load temps of about 45 degrees - which isn't that bad at all. Certainly within Intel's specs and should not pose a problem as you aren't overclocking.

Try also using a duct from one of your intake case fans to the heatsinks. That will help.

There is a warning in the bios for overheating. Should I use that and what max temp should I set it to?

50 degrees is probably good. It's a little too high for comfort, but running at that temperature won't damage anything.

What is a good freeware, cpu temp monitor utility?

Motherboard Monitor is good but it's no longer maintained. The last release will work fine though. There's also Speedfan, which will also automatically control your fan speeds using PWM. On Linux, *BSD or other *NIX, use lm-sensors and Gkrellm for a front-end. On BeOS, use BP6Mon (available from BeBits).

How low could I expect to go on lowering the cpu voltage?

See my signature. If I didn't overclock I could probably go lower.

Maybe I should try a one of those cpu burn-in programs for testing. Any recommendations for a freeware one?

There's a bunch you can download here. You can also use seti@home. However, because you're running an SMP system either get a program that is multithreaded or run two instances of a single-threaded program.

I realized at least I need to keep the heatsinks on the 500's.

Ummm... yeah. Don't take those off.

InactiveX · Post by **InactiveX** » Fri Jan 21, 2005 2:02 pm

hugoc wrote:
jakfr02 wrote:What is a good freeware, cpu temp monitor utility?
Motherboard Monitor is good but it's no longer maintained. The last release will work fine though. There's also Speedfan, which will also automatically control your fan speeds using PWM... On BeOS, use BP6Mon (available from BeBits).

You can also find them in the BP6.com Files Section.

hugoc wrote:On Linux, *BSD or other *NIX, use lm-sensors and Gkrellm for a front-end.

Perhaps these should be added to the files section. hugoc, if you have them, could you upload them? Or would anyone else?

jakfr02 · Post by **jakfr02** » Fri Jan 21, 2005 4:09 pm

I think for now I'm going to try the speedfan solution to be safe. Thanks again hugoc.

I booted my bp6 to bios and monitored the temps. They got nearly to 60c

before I turned it off. That was with the cover off. Also I don't have any heat sink epoxy stuff ? between the heatsinks and processors. I think glue stuff will help keep it cooler too. I got better heatsinks arriving any day with the recent 366's I bought. Once they arrive I'll put that glue stuff on them.

Thanks for the input.

hugoc · Post by **hugoc** » Fri Jan 21, 2005 4:17 pm

Perhaps these should be added to the files section. hugoc, if you have them, could you upload them? Or would anyone else?

I would be happy to. How does one upload, exactly?

hugoc · Post by **hugoc** » Fri Jan 21, 2005 4:20 pm

Also I don't have any heat sink epoxy stuff ? between the heatsinks and processors. I think glue stuff will help keep it cooler too.

Glue? What, do you work for NVidia or something?

Just a joke. NVidia used to superglue their heatsinks on. Glue doesn't work very well. This isn't extreme performance stuff, I don't think you need Arctic Silver or anything, but some Radio Shack thermal grease will work wonders for you.

I got better heatsinks arriving any day with the recent 366's I bought.

What heatsinks did you get? 60C is a pretty high temp, but if you turned off your fans, didn't use thermal grease and had crappy heatsinks it's easily attainable. Let that be a lesson to you.

purrkur · Post by **purrkur** » Fri Jan 21, 2005 6:36 pm

hugoc wrote: Motherboard Monitor is good but it's no longer maintained. The last release will work fine though. There's also Speedfan, which will also automatically control your fan speeds using PWM... On BeOS, use BP6Mon (available from BeBits).

See my post on speedfan over here. At the time I wrote it I did not have the time to test it out properly (messed up fan headers that I have fixed now). I want to test it once I get the time to

hugoc wrote:On Linux, *BSD or other *NIX, use lm-sensors and Gkrellm for a front-end.

Good call. That is what I do. You can also use the app "hddtemp" to monitor harddrive temperatures if your harddrive is so equipped. Gkrellm also supports it.

InactiveX wrote:Perhaps these should be added to the files section. hugoc, if you have them, could you upload them? Or would anyone else?

Not a good idea. These are both under constant development and the different distros may do their own thing in the implementation of them. Also, lm_sensors is heavily dependent on the kernel so you always need to match the correct version to the kernel you are running. I recommend telling the person in question to go to a software repository for their distro (and version) to get the packages from there.

InactiveX · Post by **InactiveX** » Fri Jan 21, 2005 7:04 pm

purrkur wrote:
InactiveX wrote:Perhaps these should be added to the files section. hugoc, if you have them, could you upload them? Or would anyone else?
Not a good idea. These are both under constant development and the different distros may do their own thing in the implementation of them. Also, lm_sensors is heavily dependent on the kernel so you always need to match the correct version to the kernel you are running. I recommend telling the person in question to go to a software repository for their distro (and version) to get the packages from there.

purrkur: Maybe you could write something about all this and add it to the FAQ?

Might help a few *nix/BSD know-nothings like me!

PS.

!!!!!!!!!! BOLD TYPE !!!!!!!!!!

(-----plus bonus capitals-----)

jakfr02 · Post by **jakfr02** » Sat Jan 22, 2005 12:25 am

Glue, paste, goop, thermal grease what's the difference. I couldn't remember what it was called.

I did the speed fan trick. That's cool beans.

I set it on auto and it shut the cpu fans off because they were cool enough around 35c. Things sure are quiter in the den now.

Thanks again.

purrkur · Post by **purrkur** » Sat Jan 22, 2005 10:31 am

InactiveX wrote:purrkur: Maybe you could write something about all this and add it to the FAQ?

Yeah, I could do that.

InactiveX wrote:PS.

!!!!!!!!!! BOLD TYPE !!!!!!!!!!

(-----plus bonus capitals-----)

NNNNNNOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

24seven · Post by **24seven** » Sat Jan 22, 2005 12:38 pm

jakfr02 wrote:Glue, paste, goop, thermal grease what's the difference. I couldn't remember what it was called.

I did the speed fan trick. That's cool beans. I set it on auto and it shut the cpu fans off because they were cool enough around 35c. Things sure are quiter in the den now.

Thanks again.

Just remember not to turn the fans right down and un-tick the auto control, forget about it, then start seti on the machine and go out like some silly sausage did last night with his dual P3 machine.

Came home to find they were at 70 deg C ish. Only took a few seconds to get them back down to normal temperature though and they are still working.

InactiveX · Post by **InactiveX** » Sat Jan 22, 2005 1:22 pm

hugoc wrote:This isn't extreme performance stuff, I don't think you need Arctic Silver or anything, but some Radio Shack thermal grease will work wonders for you.

I believe that while Arctic Silver will not offer better conduction to any great extent, the cheap stuff tends to get powdery after a while and will not work as well, whereas AS will keep its potency. I suppose that's fine as long as you check the state of the goop every so often.

24seven wrote:Just remember not to turn the fans right down and un-tick the auto control, forget about it, then start seti on the machine and go out like some silly sausage did last night with his dual P3 machine.

Came home to find they were at 70 deg C ish. Only took a few seconds to get them back down to normal temperature though and they are still working.

Phew! A lucky outcome there.

Wolfram · Post by **Wolfram** » Sat Jan 22, 2005 2:43 pm

jakfr02, be sure to check if speedfan will actually turn the fans on again. IIRC you can set a "voltage profile" for each fan (or was that bp6fsb)? Often fans need a slightly higher voltage when they start and a little less to keep spinning.

I tried passive cooling on my Celerons and it didn't work. But I have had almost no case ventilation by that time. Only one outtake fan- in the PSU, running at 5 volts

Right now I have an 8cm fan spinning at 7V on each CPU. And even that wasn't enough during hot summer days, so I connected to fans to two tubes that lead to openings in the back of the case (originally intended for outtake fans). So both fans now have a "blowhole", and temperatures do not exceed 43°C (full load, one copy of "Toast" running on each cpu).

Dave Rave · Post by **Dave Rave** » Mon Jan 24, 2005 2:59 am

running std 66mhz fsb, i think 1.85v is stable.
below that, it gets flaky, depending on how good hte caps are.
i think i had one at 1.80v, but i don't recall running lower.
they run a lot cooler at 1.80 over 2.00v

Dave Rave · Post by **Dave Rave** » Mon Jan 24, 2005 3:02 am

I just lowered one down to 1.70v and it registered only 1 cpu
back to 1.75v, I'll see if it gets into windows and keeps on running

Dave Rave · Post by **Dave Rave** » Mon Jan 24, 2005 3:07 am

and one that was recently re-capped, posted at 1.65v
but at 1.60v, it's dead.
now i got to take the cover off and reset the bios (dammit)

jakfr02 · Post by **jakfr02** » Mon Jan 24, 2005 7:28 am

Oops on the fanspeed software. I had them set at 50% power with the automatic checked. I also realized that is way too slow. My daughter and I started to watch Lion King.avi and about half way through the movie, I decided to check the temp. All temps were reading 70c+

I put everything back to 100%. Temps went back to 45-53c. I found that 90% is the quietest temp that will keep them in this range. I wonder what will happen when summer gets here.

Wolfram, I need to take the time and read some fanspeed help docs. I couldn't figure out how to save my settings, boot settings, or anything. I sure didn't understand much about the changing voltage profiles.

Dave, how low did you get with the voltage under a stable windows environment? 1.85, 1.80 or 1.75

loophole · Post by **loophole** » Mon Jan 24, 2005 10:20 pm

This isn't really on the topic, but to reset your BIOS without opening your case (the following actually only resets the settings in the SoftMenu II menu)
* turn the system off
* hold the home key while you press the power button (on the case)
* keep holding the home key down until the POST screen appears

Now your system should be running at 66MHz and the standard 2.0V again

I actually found this in an AOpen motherboard manual (AX6BC) and it has worked on all the award BIOS motherboards I've tried. Didn't work on the AMI BIOS boards though

Although, I haven't tried it on Award 6.0 BIOSs, only 4.x ones...

Hope that helps someone out there,
loophole.

hyperspace · Post by **hyperspace** » Tue Jan 25, 2005 7:15 am

It's the INSERT key.

loophole · Post by **loophole** » Wed Jan 26, 2005 4:21 pm

I always got those two mixed up - usually I hold both home and insert and it works fine

hugoc · Post by **hugoc** » Thu Jan 27, 2005 12:45 pm

With temps like that I'm suspicious of your case cooling. How many fans do you have blowing into and out of your case? It's no good having fans on the CPUs if all they're doing is stirring hot air around because no fresh air is coming to them.

If the noise is bothering you, you could fit a blowhole or duct to lead to your heatsinks and mount a quiet 80, 92 or 120 mm fan on it. There are many decent-priced quiet fans, like Nexus, Globe, and so on. Try silent pc review. One quiet 120mm fan will almost certainly move more air than the 60mm ones you have on there right now, unless you have Delta screamers - and from your temps, I seriously doubt that.

When you run your fans at full tilt, do the temps reach 45-53 under load or at idle? That's awfully hot! My temps are 18 idle, 25 under load with the fans on.

jakfr02 · Post by **jakfr02** » Mon Jan 31, 2005 2:52 pm

hugoc,

Wow, that cold. Now I got a benchmark to work toward.

I just vnc'd to the box and the temp is 53c, but it at full tilt burning a dvd to avi. The fans on the cpu are about to die. One came off an old slot processer. I bought some newer ones off ebay from a guy in Canada two weeks ago. I hope they arrive soon. I was going to cut two blow holes and duct them when they arrived.

To so my ignorance, what could happen if I run the cpus to hot?

InactiveX · Post by **InactiveX** » Tue Feb 01, 2005 1:11 pm

jakfr02 wrote:To so my ignorance, what could happen if I run the cpus to hot?

If they're a little bit hot, you will see instability, crashes, or failure to boot.

If they're very hot, you risk permanently burning out the CPUs.

jakfr02 · Post by **jakfr02** » Thu Feb 24, 2005 12:42 pm

I found some information by accident that reminded me of this posted I started. How hot can the the cpu's get? I think the limit would be 70c after reading Intel's specs at this link:

http://processorfinder.intel.com/script ... orSpd=5762